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Violin Speaking Ability

 
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famuswood
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 5:10 pm    Post subject: Violin Speaking Ability Reply with quote

I have heard many times a reference to the violin's ability to "speak". I understand the ease of speaking sensitivity. I'm curious what the forum believes affects a violin's ability to speak. What elements determine it and what improves or takes away a violin's ability to speak? Thanks very much.
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byacey
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think mainly what they are referring to is how responsive the instrument is to the bow. Lesser instruments have a slight lag from when the string is excited by the bow, to when it actually starts producing usable sound. The more responsive instruments produce sound almost instantaneously and tend to produce a stronger tone with less effort on the bow.

I believe what causes this phenomena is the dampening of the instrument. A highly dampened instrument will resist being set into a state of resonance and will take more energy input to set up the required resonance.

A more freely resonating instrument will tend to be easily excited into a resonating state and maintain resonance with less energy input.
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Michael Darnton
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 8:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bad arching and too much varnish are two easy things to blame, as well as a setup that's too tight. Usually the setup is the only one you can change after the violin's made.
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Benedict White
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What makes arching bad? Too much? Too little? The wrong shape?
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Michael Darnton
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The wrong shape.
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Chad48309
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Michael Darnton wrote:
The wrong shape.

This, in a nutshell. As far as I understand it, arching is not only extremely specific, but at the same time it is extremely subjective. The individual selection of wood used requires arching that is in tune with its specific properties. Of course, I am just a student, so please feel free to correct me if I'm mistaken.
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Lemuel
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2011 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chad48309 wrote:
... The individual selection of wood used requires arching that is in tune with its specific properties...


This would be an interesting subject...something I would like to know more about.
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Oded Kishony
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the wood is too dense/heavy it can slow response time.

light wood + high damping can result in a first rate instrument.

Oded
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famuswood
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

These comments are very helpful. Twice now I've heard the term "Dampening" and wonder what it means and how does one dampen a violin. Has this to do with arching or thickness of the plate? Please explain. Thanks
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Oded Kishony
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dampening is a property of the wood, neither arching not graduations have a significant effect on damping. Dampening is the difference between something vibrating in the air vs the same thing vibrating under water.
The sealer and varnish can increase dampening. A properly dampened instrument will sound smoother, less harsh.

Oded
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Chad48309
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oded Kishony wrote:
dampening is a property of the wood, neither arching not graduations have a significant effect on damping. Dampening is the difference between something vibrating in the air vs the same thing vibrating under water.
The sealer and varnish can increase dampening. A properly dampened instrument will sound smoother, less harsh.

Oded

However, am I correct in assuming that an over-dampened instrument will sound dull and lifeless? Or be less responsive?
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Oded Kishony
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
However, am I correct in assuming that an over-dampened instrument will sound dull and lifeless? Or be less responsive
?

The key to your question is the term -over-dampened. Yes, anything that's too much is by definition too much.

Dampening is a tricky concept. It's not necessarily dulling-especially for a bowed instrument.

Oded
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Chad48309
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oded Kishony wrote:
Quote:
However, am I correct in assuming that an over-dampened instrument will sound dull and lifeless? Or be less responsive
?

The key to your question is the term -over-dampened. Yes, anything that's too much is by definition too much.

Dampening is a tricky concept. It's not necessarily dulling-especially for a bowed instrument.

Oded

Can you give us more information or direct us to some materials we could read on the subject?
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Lemuel
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oded Kishony wrote:
dampening is a property of the wood, neither arching not graduations have a significant effect on damping. Dampening is the difference between something vibrating in the air vs the same thing vibrating under water.
The sealer and varnish can increase dampening. A properly dampened instrument will sound smoother, less harsh.


Oded,

You mentioned in another post that vibrations are dependent on three factors: 1) Specific gravity (mass or weight) 2) Stiffness and 3) Dampening

Since you also mentioned that neither arching nor graduation have a significant effect on damping being an inherent quality of the wood, how wood (pun intended) the mass or stiffness properties determine arching. I know this is a broad question...sorry. Maybe you can share some generalizations.
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