Violin Forum/Message Board

Michael Darnton · Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 7:41 am Post subject:

Any amount of money you can imagine, from anyone after the start of the Industrial Revolution.
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Joseph Leahy · Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 10:49 am Post subject:

Michael Darnton · Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 11:01 am Post subject:

The way I'm currently making, the major thing that gets affected by thick vs thin is the power curve of the instrument, and response is a matter of arching. For me a lot of the tonal characteristics are a matter of where I put things thick and thin and setup, relatively, not the gross thicknesses overall.

I know, however, that if the arching isn't correct, that making a violin thinner will make it easier to play. But if you need to thin it to get response, that's the result of errors in arching and you're throwing away other potentials if you have to thin a violin to make it work, IMO.
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Canuck · Member Joined: 15 Oct 2012 Posts: 29

This very esoteric thread probably has no place for a fiddler. In other words, someone who is by no means a luthier. But I have three friends who make violins. I have had the opportunity to sample their various instruments, and there isn't one of those instruments that I would swap for my main instrument. Many fiddlers whom I meet with have tried this violin, and anyone who tries it, remarks at how the tone and responsiveness agrees with them. Including two of the three violin makers who have tried it. In fact, one person who tried it, and who is a professional (not a luthier or a symphony player), and who tells me that her instrument cost her as much as a house, has commented on the sound she gets from my violin. The Internet blurb I read on this maker (Collingwood) indicates that their main forte' was "concert" violins.

During a recent visit to the store where I buy my strings, I was given the opportunity to sample a French violin with a $ 20,000 price tag on it. To be honest, I wouldn't have swapped them straight across for mine.

From the sound of things, this violin wouldn't likely receive a second look from a professional symphony player. But it pleases me.

actonern · Super Member Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 444

Canuk:

Good to read your story... the secret of happiness, they say, is to be content with what we have... you seem to have found it!

ctviolin · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 10:37 am Post subject:

Michael Darnton · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 10:47 am Post subject:

Well, this kind of thing is why I no longer trust my own taste. If players who are much better musicians than I am prefer something different than I do as their tool, who am I to question it?

To put it in context, in my classes I often have a very hard time weaning beginners from Exacto knives. They don't understand why a real knife is better until they have really learned to use one well, which is something that doesn't happen right away. Are they right about Exacto knives? No, of course they're not. But at their skill level, not having to sharpen is more important to them than having a tool that does the job better. If they keep believing in their own taste, and many do, they never learn what a better tool is capable of in the right hands.

When I was being trained, I was taught to look at what people better than me were doing, and try to understand it and learn from that. That's the only way to learn and get better. Being inspired by your own knowledge and standards is the one sure path to becoming second- or third-rate, and staying there forever.
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ctviolin · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 12:15 pm Post subject:

Lemuel · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:18 pm Post subject:

Ha, Ha, I find this pretty funny....

As luthiers , the both of you are saying not to trust so much in your own tastes, knowledge and standards, and here I'm after entering the luthier world saying to myself as a musician not to trust my own tastes, knowledge and standards.....

Michael Darnton · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:51 pm Post subject:

Well, I don't advocate trusting just anyone. There are a lot of violinists I wouldn't listen to. The most useful ones are the ones that (1) have had the opportunity to play a lot of violins and (2) are really, really good players.

That's the reason that the person playing the violins on Bein and Fushi's Miracle Makers CD is Elmar Oliveira--he's and great player AND an semi-amateur dealer, and gets to play a lot of different violins in the course of that, so he can adapt to a new violin really quickly.
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Lemuel · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 4:20 pm Post subject:

Yes, you've definitely made a good point. I've listened to the CD before, and I agree...Elmar is a really a great violinist.

Chet Bishop · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:49 pm Post subject:

"Look at what people better than you are doing: try to understand it and learn from that. That's the only way to learn and get better. Being inspired by your own knowledge and standards is the one sure path to becoming second- or third-rate, and staying there forever."
Michael Darnton

That is a great quote, Michael! It is applicable across the board in life, and parallels Joseph Heller's famous quote: "Try to learn from the mistakes of others; you can't hope to live long enough to make them all yourself." (Catch-22)
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Michael Darnton · Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 7:00 pm Post subject:

Bob Bein's advice to me was to always attach yourself to something better than you, and try to be that.

Hang with smarter people than you are, make your shop look like the better shops you'd visited. Dress the part you wanted to be, not what you were. Better to be the small fish in the big pond, striving to be big, than the big fish in the small pond, with nowhere to grow.

He tried to mimic the look of Wurlitzer in 1960 for B&F, which included rotting windows with peeling paint that he refused to repaint, because that's how Wurlitzer, the best shop in the world at the time, was, so you can see how far he took it.
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johngia · Member Joined: 10 Nov 2009 Posts: 84

When I was still a productive member of society <g> in the work world, I used to tell my boss that I didn't want to be the dumbest, or the smartest person on the team --- be somewhere in the middle. I want to not only learn from the smarter ones, but be a teacher to the less experienced.

"Hang with smarter people" --- try to be like them. That's why I lay my inexperience on the line and post here.

ctviolin · Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 12:44 pm Post subject:

Thanks everyone for making this an interesting subject.

I'll cop to it myself now.

My own price is now $3,500.

When I first started making them, my price was $350 - $500...

Thanks again for all of the responses.
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